ILVideo80 "HP 92198" : how it works?

[floppy_stuttgart]

I just wanted to know what happens at somebody here using the ILVideo. If no-One is using it and can explain what he experienced on its windows machine, thats fine.
It has (yes) nothing to do directly with HP-IL.

[mike-stgt]

I just wanted to know what happens at somebody here using the ILVideo.

You'd like to know "what happens at me" -- mental or emotional? -- using ILVideo80? Well, honestly, I am happy as can be that it works quite similar as described in the accompanying help file.

If no-One is using it and can explain what he experienced on its windows machine, thats fine.

It's great fun, frankly, a quintessentially recommendable experience, without compromise, right from the start.
HTH

[floppy_stuttgart]

Nutzlose Antwort.

[floppy_stuttgart]

The manual for the 80-Column display interface can be found here: http://www.hhcworld.com/files/compendiu ... manual.pdf

Thanks.
In fact I just realized that having ILPER is enough for me now. ILVideo80 additionally to ILPER on my PC screen dont add anything.

[mike-stgt]

Nutzlose Antwort.

For sure it's a futil reply, fittingly your query how to use a Windows program under WINE under Linux in a forum "All about the HP-41C caclulators". That's as asking for "100 g liverwurst, pleeease" in a flower shop, you will probably also get a remark like "sie sind wohl Pfälzer."

[floppy_stuttgart]

SOLVED (was a "wine" issue).
https://askubuntu.com/questions/1023808 ... f-a-window

Code: Select all

Run winecfg, go to "Graphics", and either [b]uncheck "Allow the window manager to decorate the windows"[/b] or check "Emulate a virtual desktop"

Result in the attachment.

[floppy_stuttgart]

Since the window appearance was solved, a new topic with the HP41 hardware; see the attachment.
Now, how to have the outputs to IL-Video, too, in the setup described hereafter
a) hardware HP41 & Pilbox
b) Pil-Box-Bridge
c) Ilper
d) IL-video
Looks like the video get forgotten. not sure of this (however, that video is not mandatory since ilper has the printer area).
Any advice is welcome.

[floppy_stuttgart]

Comment to the previous Post: when the in/out port setup is different, then the Video can be used.. but nomore the printer (new issue).

[jeffcalc]

I guess it's my turn to answer

Now, how to have the outputs to IL-Video, too, in the setup described hereafter
a) hardware HP41 & Pilbox
b) Pil-Box-Bridge
c) Ilper
d) IL-video
Looks like the video get forgotten. not sure of this.

Not sure to understand well what "video get forgotten" can mean.

Comment to the previous Post: when the in/out port setup is different, then the Video can be used.. but nomore the printer (new issue).

Maybe this clarifies a bit the question.
So is the question "How to send print commands to both ILPer printer and IL-video" ?
If you mean simultaneously, the answer is: no for most print commands.
If you mean in turn, yes it's easy, just SELECT the targeted printer/video device.

More generally, the use of SELECT on the HP-41 is convenient for most simple configurations (it was the goal of the HP-41 HP-IL design), but is not as flexible as the HP-71B addressing scheme.
Especially with this setup with 2 drives and 2 printer-class devices, there are for instance impossible tasks, such as getting the catalog of drive 2 listed on the ILPer printer (if someone finds a way, let me know!)

But the fun is in the experimentation !

J-F

[mike-stgt]

Especially with this setup with 2 drives and 2 printer-class devices, there are for instance impossible tasks, such as getting the catalog of drive 2 listed on the ILPer printer (if someone finds a way, let me know!)

In contrast to other programs simulating a single virtual IL device ILPer is quite handy and offers a bundle of the mostly used ones. The description shows how their internal sequence may be altered. Result see screen shot below. First I executed LCAT, its output is automatically displayed on the video device, next I did SF 15 to get following commands traced. 3 SELECT is still shown on the 82163A while DIR and its output is printed on the ILPer display as requested.

Output of DIR from 2nd disk shown on ILPer's printer

You know, the impossible we do right away while wonder take a little longer

But the fun is in the experimentation !

No comment -- what could be taken as an offending comment so let me state more precisely, I prefere a good documentatation that pictures all features of a program so I may decide what's useful for me and my goal. Trial and error is like looking for easter eggs, quite impossible to find that way how to change the internal sequence of devices bundled within ILPer.

HTH
M.

[jeffcalc]

In contrast to other programs simulating a single virtual IL device ILPer is quite handy and offers a bundle of the mostly used ones. The description shows how their internal sequence may be altered. Result see screen shot below. First I executed LCAT, its output is automatically displayed on the video device, next I did SF 15 to get following commands traced. 3 SELECT is still shown on the 82163A while DIR and its output is printed on the ILPer display as requested.

OK, in that setup, changing the device order allowed you to get the DIR output to the ILPer printer window.
We could just have removed the 92198.
But I'm sure you understood what I meant: in a certain configuration (to be clear: with ILPer and an extra printer/display in a certain order, and HP-IL module only), you won't be able to get some DIR output to a some device - in your setup, getting DIR output of 2nd drive to the 82163 device - due to the limitation of the SELECT command.
With extra special modules, it could be possible (for instance the X-IL; see how to do it?).

BTW, what is LCAT? Not in the HP-IL module and not in usual HP-IL extensions (X-IO, X-IL)

HTH
M.

At least it's fun to discuss on HP-IL!

J-F

[mike-stgt]

We could just have removed the 92198.

The impossible task was to have two printing devices within the loop, one within ILPer and another one. Removing the 92198 is a different setup

But I'm sure you understood what I meant...

Yes, today I did, probably. No doubt the HP71B is much more flexible with its PRINTER IS and DISPLAY IS settings.

BTW, what is LCAT? Not in the HP-IL module and not in usual HP-IL extensions (X-IO, X-IL)

See in Warren's archive "82183A Extended IO Module.pdf", Appendix C 'Examples', Printing an HP-IL Device Directory (The LCAT Program), p. 75 ff.

HTH
M.

At least it's fun to discuss on HP-IL!

J-F

First, my "HTH" was rather meant for others, not aimed in your direction -- because regarding HP-IL it's mostly me who has questions and you do have the answers.
Second, for sure it's fun to discuss about HP-IL and its virtual counterpart, especially if the questions are not too far off topic and if there are still experts to find solutions (without guesswork). For example, TACS during SDA is in my device simulators commented with "WTF" (Woot!? That's funny...) since I did not find any description yet. Currently I use a work around that works. Unsatisfying, not the canonical way, guesswork I dislike.

[floppy_stuttgart]

Thanks. I was learning the HP IL. (see Manual HP-IL Chapter 4).
When starting my setup, "XEQ DIR" in the HP41. The output went to "Ilper" Printer.
When putting "2" in X, then "XEQ SELECT", the "XEQ DIR" was the IL-Video.
When putting "1" in X, then "XEQ SELECT", the "XEQ DIR" was the IL-Printer.

[rprosperi]

Clever solution Mike!

[floppy_stuttgart]

BTW, what is LCAT? Not in the HP-IL module and not in usual HP-IL extensions (X-IO, X-IL)

J-F

here it is.

Code: Select all

LBL "LCAT"  ; 82183A Extended IO Module.pdf Appendix C 'Examples', XROM 23,xx
            ; Printing an HP-IL Device Directory (The LCAT Program), p. 75 ff.
            ; recommended there
            ;   https://forum.hp41.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=552&start=20
            ;
            ; change log
            ;  2022 05 29 creation by user floppy from
            ;             https://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/
            ;
            ; create raw files with "hp41uc.exe /t=LCAT.TXT /r /k"
            ; then upload in PC emulator / virtual drive / HP41 hardware
;
AUTOIO      ; find number of devices on HP-IL
CF 29
FIX 0
XROM 23,33  ; NLOOP
CLA
ARCL X
"\- DEVICES" ; print number of devices
PRA
1 E3
/           ; stores a loop counter
1           ; return primary address
+
STO 00
XROM 23,45  ; RCLSEL
STO 01
CLA
"PRIMARY ADR. "
ARCL X
PRA         ; print primary address
"ADR   ID    AID"
"\-  CLASS"
PRA         ; print directory head
;
LBL 01
CLA
10
RCL 00      ; recall loop counter
X<Y?        ; ensure that address is two digits
"0"
ARCL X
"\- "
ACA         ; accumulates address into print buffer
SELECT      ; select device having address equal to loop counter
SF 25
ID          ; return device ID
FC?C 25
"--------"
8
XROM 23,09  ; ALENGIO     ; find length of ID string
-
X=0?
GTO 04
;
; fills out device ID string to eight characters
;
LBL 03
"\- "
DSE X
GTO 03
;
LBL 04
"\- "
100
SF 25
AID
RCL 01       ; reselect originalprimary device
SELECT       ; from HP-IL
RDN
FC?C 25      ; branches if device did not send accessory ID
GTO 05
X<Y?         ; appends a space if accessory ID < 100
"\- "        ; appends text in HP41UC https://www.hpmuseum.org/software/41uc.htm
ARCL X
ACA          ; adds ALPHA register string to print buffer
;
; determine device class
;
16
/
INT
16
*
XEQ IND X    ; place device class string into ALPHA
;
LBL 05
ACA
PRBUF        ; print printer buffer
ISG 00       ; increment loop counter
GTO 01       ; branches for additional devices
RTN
;
; device class alpha strings
;
LBL 00
" CNTRLLR"
RTN
;
LBL 16
" MASS ST"
RTN
;
LBL 32
" PRINTER"
RTN
;
LBL 48
" DISPLAY"
RTN
;
LBL 64
" INTRFCE"
RTN
;
LBL 80
" INSTRMT"
RTN
;
LBL 96
" GRAPHIC"
END

[Garth]

Since this topic seems to have run its course, I thought I'd address something that's frequently a difficulty for non-native English speakers, the matter of how to ask a question in English.  Hopefully some will find it helpful.

"How it works" is a method, a noun clause, not a question.  When questions start with "How," "Why," "Where," "When," "Who," etc., the next word generally needs to be a modal, like "can," "could," "will," "would," "shall," "should," "may," "might," and "must," and in some cases, "do," "does," "did," "is," "are," "was," and "were" can be used as modals.  There might be some I'm forgetting.  Modals are a type of verb.  The easiest giveaway that one is a modal might be that you cannot put "to" in front of it, like "to can," "to shall," etc. which are incorrect.  Also, the 3rd-person form does not take on the s at the end like non-modal verbs do, like "he walks," "he works," etc..

So the "How" question would be "How does it work?" (not "How it works"?)  The one about buffer interference can be asked various ways, like "How do you avoid buffer interference?" or "How can I avoid buffer interference?" or "How is buffer interference avoided?" (but not "How to avoid buffer interference?")